On Other Earths Too, in the Past or in the Future!

If you have watched the amazing video of Dannion Brinkley which is the centerpiece of my previous post, you have heard him reveal a particularly important thing for us all to know – or remember: that in the truth of our being, we all are “great, mighty spiritual beings having dignity, direction and purpose”, deliberately come into the challenge of this world of oblivion and limitation, to see if even in the midst of such conditions we can still make each of our every moment decisions out of Compassion and Caring instead of our temporary ego’s wish to dominate and impress. This is what has been told to Dannion repeatedly, in various ways, by the beings of Light he encountered during his NDEs, and they added it took  a lot of courage to come in this world and go through such difficult adventures here.

All this was astonishing news for Dannion… and possibly also for those of you reading this, who are new to my blog and have not seen the older posts I already dedicated to spreading exactly these kind of momentous news about us human beings, which I had myself been so astonished about when reading them first long ago from Sri Aurobindo.

I had hardly familiarized my mind with such an unusual viewpoint, and accepted it for all my own numerous lifetimes on earth, when I found yet another piece by Sri Aurobindo, that one not only echoing this view but actually going even further: in ‘Essays Divine and Human’, the essay titled ‘Beginning and End’ sees Sri Aurobindo  drawing once again, as so often, such a huge vista of the really Big Picture as to be just staggering for our present feeble mentality and cowardly heart. Here is but a short passage of that essay, that so many years after reading it for the first time, only now I am able to dare read again in spite of what had been for me the horrendous new revelation it contained:

‘The experiment of human life on an earth is not now for the first time enacted. It has been conducted a million times before and the long drama will again a million times be repeated. In all that we do now, our dreams, our discoveries, our swift or difficult attainments we profit subconsciously by the experience of innumerable precursors and our labour will be fecund in planets unknown to us and in worlds yet uncreated. The plan, the peripeties, the denouement differ continually, yet are always governed by the conventions of an eternal Art. God, Man, Nature are the three perpetual symbols.

The idea of eternal recurrence affects with a shudder of alarm the mind entrenched in the minute, the hour, the years, the centuries, all the finite’s unreal defences. But the strong soul conscious of its own immortal stuff and the inexhaustible ocean of its ever-flowing energies is seized by it with the thrill of an inconceivable rapture. It hears behind the thought the childlike laughter and ecstasy of the Infinite.’

Well, friends, as you can see it would seem we aren’t necessarily into this for just a few aeons of lifetimes here on this Earth: some of us still don’t find it to be enough!…

Also in some  recently channeled books (from Lee Carroll’s Kryon, for example) – and I seem to remember Jane Robert’s Seth was saying somehow the same thing – one can read indeed that most of us here are spirits cheerful and adventurous enough to have found all these crazy challenges interesting and even amusing, to the point of our having been actually at it since further eons elsewhere, and of our rejoicing gleefully already at the perspective of yet another round and endless other rounds of similarly huge challenges still elsewhere in other corners of the Universe!!! We spirits bold and courageous enough to incarnate again and again on difficult worlds like this Earth, are like the Elite Battalion among spirits, and looked at with awe by others!…

That should give us a measure – if that is at all possible – of what our divine Nature is about: secretly but solidly based on our core Being consisting in eternal and indestructible Satchidananda (another post about that soon), we can truly try out again and again, if we wish, the boldest of adventures, as no real death or damage can effectively destroy us, but only affect us temporarily…! It is just sheer FUN!…

To some of us at least…

I for one don’t seem to be quite like that. I am only starting to glimpse timidly and from the corner of my eye at this truly gigantic perspective on things which Sri Aurobindo brings in with this stunning passage, and which only decades of conscious inner development have finally enabled me to read again calmly, and even pause to consider, without my poor mind going nuts. But I must admit I  for one seem to be a particularly unadventurous spirit: some sort of ‘Hobbity’ kind of spirit, as Tolkien would put it… Or is it perhaps only my outer personality in this lifetime which is that way, as one more challenge for my spirit to deal with?… I can’t even stand roller coasters, or merely imagine myself riding one, so you see what I mean!!!

I hope many of my visitors here are spontaneously bolder spirits and will appreciate to its full magnificence the prospect of willingly and joyfully taking on yet any number of other earths after this one is won to the foreseen and promised Life Divine!…

As for myself, I am likely to rather luxuriate first of all for a very long time here on this Earth, enjoying the said Life Divine, precisely once we have at last won that Victory already for this Earth; and then I may chose to just tiptoe out of it all, my laurels well won… But after such a nice and long and enjoyable rest in Divine Living here, who knows after all?. I may find myself crazy enough a spirit to be tempted yet again – along with some eternal dear buddies of mine like some of you, my readers, might well be – by some new challenge to take on,  on some other Earth somewhere, far, far away in some other solar system…

2-earthsizedpl

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Natalie Sudman’s NDE,Robert Monroe’s OBEs & Seth’s Teachings through Jane Roberts

I have recently studied with a lot of interest Dr. Eben Alexander’s first book, ‘Proof of Heaven’, about his extraordinary 2006 NDE during the seven days he remained in coma, his neo-cortex completely destroyed by a sudden attack of a very rare and usually fatal bacterial meningitis; his survival had been quite an unexpected miracle, surpassed only by the full and fast recovery that followed, and the complete change in his understanding of life as well of death.

Just as for the equally important book by Anita Moorjani, ‘Dying to be me’, it had been on a Tuesday afternoon that I had found this great book, while on duty at our excellent specialized Research Library, in the present main space of the ‘Laboratory of Evolution’, the Research and Documentation Center in Auroville that I founded in 1984 and am still heading, but now busy mostly with the research aspect of the work. .

Well, two days ago, it was again Tuesday afternoon, and so the day of my weekly duty  participating in the Library work. At the end of it, just upon leaving, I was thrilled to stumble upon a second book by Eben Alexander, titled this time ‘The Map of Heaven’, and I took it of course at once. Back home, I eagerly went through it within the next few.hours before sleeping.

The next morning, which was yesterday, I read it all over again, to ascertain some of the  important facts mentioned that had particularly struck me already the first time.

One of those facts was a specific quote by a Natalie Sudman, the NDE of whom Eben was saying had been especially extraordinary and deep. Armed with the intriguing title of Natalie’s own book, ‘Application of Impossible Things’ (!),  I went to my office downstairs,.googled it along with the name of the author, and spent the whole afternoon watching YouTube videos of her being interviewed by various  show hosts. Then I had to stop for it was getting late, but today I resumed watching, and ended up applauding full heartedly with the audience for a talk I had just watched her giving, after a short introduction by the elderly lady host:

As I am myself an ‘experiencer too, and on top of it a researcher on this NDE topic since decades, besides practicing a spiritual path of conscious evolution, the ‘Integral Yoga’, since even longer, I would say I know quite a lot, so I didn’t really learn anything I hadn’t at least read about before.

But what won my total enthusiasm was that this young lady proved to be a living example of experiences I have read about only in the explanations or descriptions given by Sri Aurobindo and his feminine counterpart, the Mother; and later on, from the mid-sixties to the mid-eighties, by the discarnate entity calling himself Seth, in the brilliant books he dictated through an entranced young lady, at first rather bewildered: Jane Roberts.

The third source I know some specific facts described by Natalie were reported also by, is Robert Monroe, founder of The Monroe Institute (TMI), and I noticed some specific expressions that he used in his OBE books were used as well by Natalie during her talks.

All those sources I have just listed out are by far the deepest and most encompassing teachings I know of, so this gives an idea of the truly incredible level of understanding that Natalie demonstrates, of all those “impossible things” she speaks about, for not only she experienced them during her NDE and remembered them after it, but she is able to articulate her descriptions and explanations of them in terms simple enough to be grasped, to some extent at least, by her audiences, starting with her hosts. Her own remarkable simplicity and tremendous sense of fun, whether in or out of her body, are also irresistibly contagious, which is wonderful, for it helps to immediately diffuse and lighten up the apparent gravity of some of her statements, sometimes so stunning as to be altogether shocking if it were not for the total matter-of-fact way she presents it all and then explains it too…

Well, a big thank you to Dr. Eben Alexander, not only for this new book of his, very interesting and moving in its own right (it even evokes a new step in our terrestrial evolution), but also for introducing me to this quite remarkable indeed other NDExperiencer! I hope you, my visitors, have enjoyed, or will enjoy the video above as much as I did… to the point perhaps of writing down below your own comments about it (the button for doing that is actually above, at the beginning of each post, in the left margin…!).

And now I am going back to my room upstairs, for some dinner and later some sleep as well, but with a deep feeling of happiness, for having been treated the whole day with such a nicely filling diet of the “impossible things” I too relish living and hearing about…

 

 

Angels? Flavio etc say they have NO WINGS

Something important we have to realize and rectify in the traditional image we get from our various cultures about the Angels: they do exist, oh yes, but they have NO wings… because they don’t need any for floating or flying around as they do.

Their body, not being physical, is weightless and moves just at will, with tremendous speed, to wherever they want to go. No need of wings for that at all.

It is exactly the same, by the way, for any of us human beings when we are between two incarnations and so, don’t have a physical body either; or also during an incarnation, when we are temporarily out of our body for whatever reason.  For example, even simply in our dreams, when we are flying, it is not an illusion, and it has nothing to do with any freudian symbolic sexual activity but it is real flying, something that happens very easily and frequently when we have gone out of our body during our sleep and are going around simply in our subtle body, which is weightless as it is not composed of physical matter and is not subject to the effect of Gravity.

In the recent Oscar-awarded beautiful thriller movie, ‘GRAVITY’,  happening way out in Space, we could see how away from the Earth’s gravitational field the bodies of the astronauts weighed nothing and were floating in the space of the cabin together with their tools, their tumblers and whatever drinks should have been in them, if they were not kept down solidly with the various straps and other devices provided for that purpose. It was even worse outside of the spaceship, because there in Space itself the slightest wrong movement could send an astronaut very far away from the vicinity of the ship, and cause him or her to be lost for ever; their only safety was the strong cable they were attached to, connecting them to the ship so as to prevent such a horrible death from happening.

In the movie, the woman-astronaut ultimately sole survivor from the ship after its accident, has to spend long hours all alone in Space facing constantly the effects of non-gravity, that make everything and every maneuver more difficult and more dangerous for her as the situation keeps worsening, At the end of the film, when finally she has gone victoriously through it all and she manages a precarious landing of her ejected capsule… into the ocean, but luckily near the coast, she swims slowly to the shore and arriving at last on the beach, emerges first on all four, and only then staggers to her feet, overjoyed to be still alive, but thoroughly exhausted, savoring now fully her renewed experience of the contact with the Earth, and with… GRAVITY.

Yes, we usually take Gravity for granted while going about our daily life; but even while we are in physical bodies there seem to be specific conditions under which the physical body itself isn’t subject any more to Gravity and is able to temporarily  float above the ground, in a breaking of normal physical laws that is called ‘levitation’, recorded since millennia all over the planet. Many saints of the Catholic faith have been known to levitate in that way, often against their own will and with total embarrassment at the understandable fame such a feat was giving them, sometimes attracting huge crowds eager to watch the phenomenon occur. In various other cultures too, especially from Asia, Tibet for example, monks and generally holy people are known to often have that capacity. It is as if the inner contact of the soul with the Spirit pervading all, is somehow in those instances communicated to the body too, in a way that neutralizes the normal effects of Gravity on Matter.

Well, as far as Angels are concerned, the problem of Gravity simply doesn’t arise at all,  on the contrary it is floating and flying that are the normality in their non-physical reality. But to our human physical rationality this cannot be done without wings of some sort like the birds have, the only creatures we know that are able to fly. As Angels do have all around them and particularly all around the upper part of their body the white brilliance that their luminous being emanates naturally, that radiance could easily be interpreted and represented on pictures as resplendent white wings, and it is indeed what is shown on the many paintings we have of Angels from many centuries past.

So what nowadays has come to be considered the most important sign that makes you recognize the human-like being in front of you as an Angel, is that this being has wings.

What transpires from all more recent testimonies, though,  and even from some old ones, is that Angels actually have no wings at all. Their real main characteristic as Angels is rather the Light that they are constituted of, which makes them look like the flame of a candle, except for their usual huge size (two meters at least, unless for some reason they have chosen to appear in a smaller form than the one they truly have).

In the 1993 worldwide best-seller from French journalist Pierre Jovanovic, ‘Enquete sur l’Existence des Anges Gardiens’, of the saints, old or new, and of the Near Death Experiencers who are listed out as having all had a conscious contact with an Angel, and more specifically with their own Guardian Angel, quite a few haven’t seen but only heard Him or Her. But of all those who have also seen It, only some have seen It with the wings they traditionally are supposed to have. In most cases it is on the contrary noticed that they DON’T have wings, but this doesn’t disturb the viewer at all as the light and love they radiate are proof enough of what they are.

Already when reading the second book about his OBEs by Robert Monroe, ‘Far Journeys’, published in 1985, I had noted the passage where  in an out of body state he talks with one of those advanced beings he calls jokingly for himself  ‘INSPECS’ (Intelligent Species…!) for the first time directly within the boundaries of their own space, thanks to them reducing considerably their actually very hot light so that he can come that far without melting. This time he is trying all he can to elucidate what ‘THEY’ are, by putting inwardly to his ‘INSPEC’ friend all the questions he can, as precisely as he can, and the ‘INSPEC’ answers in the same inner,  telepathic way. At some point the dialogue goes like this, following Bob Monroe’s meandering thoughts after having taken this very bold step of going much further than usual towards those beings he loves and reveres tremendously:

‘This was becoming an event not anything like what I expected. I was rapidly losing my sense of awe. It was replaced with a great feeling of warmth, of understanding, much on the order of old deep friendships, yet filled with intense respect, not the usual pattern of expected angels, if that is what THEY were.

(We can quickly grow some wings if you wish.)

No, no, please, no wings. No halos either, although I get the clear percept, staring at my INSPEC – friend?…

(At least that, for now)

I could understand how humans with limited but definite momentary super-vision could add a halo to make the human-formed INSPEC stand out as different. A brightly radiant form? How often in human history has such a perception taken place? Miracle workers, saints, local medicine-men, and last-timers on their final run, no doubt.

(No doubt at all.)’

With the same compassionate sense of humor,  the entity calling himself Seth, in ‘Seth Speaks’, channeled by Jane Roberts, explains how, when receiving the confused souls of newly deceased humans, he and other spirits responsible for welcoming them and orienting them in that other dimension of Reality were often at first putting on some wings so as to meet the expectations most newly-dead persons would have of seeing angels, angels who would of course have wings to qualify as proper angels. Only for souls that didn’t have such an expectation, or who after some time wouldn’t have it any longer, were the welcoming beings free to remain as they truly were: without wings.

Of course it is the same with the souls arriving there just for a short while during a Near Death Experience (NDE), as quite a few NDErs have seen for themselves and have reported later on with surprise…

As for our two dear young brothers from Buenos Aires, Markos and Flavio (see previous posts), both could see Angels when they were still little, and the Angels they saw either out of the window or up there with God were easily recognizable loving bright lights, but without wings either.

It has been very difficult for me to find through my google search  for this post a representation of an Angel that would show Him or Her without wings. Between all the innumerable winged angels, including the two extreme distortions which were  a-plenty too among them, on the one hand of the sexy, seductive, bare-breasted she-angels and on the other hand of the cute baby-angels so sickeningly sweet and insignificant they were meaningless, I was glad to finally find a decent Angel worthy of that name, with some visible Inner Light… and a radiating aura instead of wings! All my gratitude to the human artist who was inspired to make this painting of the awesome Being I’ll henceforth call ‘The Beautiful Blue Angel’:

 

Image taken, with gratitude, from anges | larevolutioninterieure larevolutioninterieure.com

 

 

Anita Moorjani & A New Perception of Time

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You may remember the especially extraordinary NDE that happened to Anita Moorjani (see my older post about her) and completely healed her body totally invaded by cancerous cells, when her vital organs had been already shutting off.

One part of her story had the most impact upon me, the part in which she says this:

“In addition, I seemed to understand that, as tests had been taken for my organ functions (and the results were not out yet), that if I chose life, the results would show that my organs were functioning normally. If I chose death, the results would show organ failure as the cause of death, due to cancer. I was able to change the outcome of the tests by my choice!

I made my choice, and as I started to wake up (in a very confused state, as I could not at that time tell which side of the veil I was on), the doctors came rushing into the room with big smiles on their faces saying to my family

“Good news – we got the results and her organs are functioning – we can’t believe it!! Her body really did seem like it had shut down!”

After that, I began to recover rapidly. The doctors had been waiting for me to become stable before doing a lymph node biopsy to track the type of cancer cells, and they could not even find a lymph node big enough to suggest cancer (upon entering the hospital my body was filled with swollen lymph nodes and tumors the size of lemons, from the base of my skull all the way to my lower abdomen). They did a bone marrow biopsy, again to find the cancer activity so they could adjust the chemotherapy according to the disease, and there wasn’t any in the bone marrow. The doctors were very confused, but put it down to me suddenly responding to the chemo. Because they themselves were unable to understand what was going on, they made me undergo test after test, all of which I passed with flying colors, and clearing every test empowered me even more! I had a full body scan, and because they could not find anything, they made the radiologist repeat it again!!!!

Because of my experience, I am now sharing with everyone I know that miracles are possible in your life every day. After what I have seen, I realize that absolutely anything is possible, and that we did not come here to suffer. Life is supposed to be great, and we are very, very loved. The way I look at life has changed dramatically, and I am so glad to have been given a second chance to experience “heaven on earth”.”

The Oncology specialist, at the same time an NDE specialist, who much later read the report she wrote to his NDE documentation organization, was so amazed he asked her several additional questions, the 4th one being this:

Q.4 The fact that the medical tests, already done, would have their outcome changed depending on your choice is remarkable.  If you had chosen not to return to earth, do you have a sense when the medical tests would have changed- after your choice in earthly time, or would your choice have affected the tests at the time the blood was drawn which, in earthly time, I understand would have been before you made your choice to return to earth.  Any further comments you have on this would be greatly appreciated.

Answer to Question 4:  “This is one of the points that is so hard to express with our limited 3 dimensional language.  Time seems to have a completely different meaning on that side.  What I felt was that all possibilities exist simultaneously – it just depends which one you choose.    Sort of like being in an elevator, where all the floors of a building exist, but you can choose which floor to get off on.  So if all the future possibilities exist for me to choose from, then I assume all the past scenarios exist too.  So depending which future possibility I choose, that will also determine which past automatically comes with it (I chose life, so it affected the past, choosing the appropriate test result for the organ function).  I hope I am making sense.  It’s very clear in my thoughts, but it is hard to write. When I was being presented the choice, I actually saw a vision of my lab report which said, on the heading:  Diagnosis:  Organ Failure.  Then on the body of the report:  Death due to organ failure caused by Hodgkin’s lymphoma.  When I actually saw the report after coming back, the sheet of paper looked almost identical, and the heading matched word for word:  Diagnosis: Organ Failure, however, the body read:  There is no evidence of organ failure.  I actually got goosebumps looking at that report, knowing what it could have read.”

Wow. Such a possibility of changing past events – something supposed to be impossible – so that they can match the actual present results of one’s conscious choices opens up stupendous new realms of Inner Action for all of us. Anita Morjani was absolutely no Yogi, let alone no great Yogi, for accomplishing such a feat. But during that ‘time’ that her consciousness spent in the True Reality, she was aware also of her own True Reality within It all, and so she had the inner powers that go naturally with that truer consciousness and so she changed the so-called Past…

When about a year ago (see my older post about that) I joined the course, unexpectedly happening right here in Auroville, that I had just read about and become very interested in, a course about some Russian scientists’ new, spiritual approach for healing all kinds of bodily problems, while taking the course together with other participants it struck me that those Russian scientists were actually using the same astonishing method that had spontaneously demonstrated itself through the ‘miraculous’ healing of Anita Moorjani after her somewhat unusual NDE: thanks to her decision, made OUTSIDE OF TIME,  and in her higher consciousness, not to die, but to go back to life in a healed body, even some of the events prior to the moment when she had started dying, were changed in accordance to that later decision of hers not to die after all…!!! And of course her body too underwent all the changes necessary for that new reality to become true, to such a point that no trace of the cancer previously overwhelmingly and terminally present in her body could be found any more anywhere: just as if it had never existed at all…

It all reminded me powerfully also of what I had read already from Sri Aurobindo forty years ago, but at the time  my mind had been quite unable to ingest such a hugely mind-shaking concept, so contrary to all current beliefs; its potential consequences were just too much for my mind to comprehend then, let alone accept. After reading that especially surprising ‘Aphorism’ of his, I had inwardly told Sri Aurobindo with a shudder, “Okay, this one I’ll try to grapple with later, right now it’s totally beyond me!!! I’s actually scaring me, so big a thing it is!…”

It was about the actual simultaneity of all events.

Yep – it said it was all really happening all at the same time… all that we call Past, Present, and Future! All that our presently limited mental perception forces us to see as events lined up in a linear sequence: Linear Time, as opposed to Real Time, which is more like an eternal, all-inclusive Present.

Much later, when I discovered the Seth Books channeled by Jane Roberts, I realized Seth too was saying the same thing: what Seth was speaking of he was calling “the Spacious Present”, it was the true sense of Time, and it included indeed all there ever was, is and ever will be… in all the possible variations of it all. Stupendous.

This is why the perception of Time is one of the first things that is currently being changed in the ever vaster capacity our mind is gradually acquiring, under the continuously increasing influence of the truer Consciousness-Force at work directly upon Earth and within Matter itself, since 1956: what Sri Aurobindo and Mother called the “Supramental Consciousness”, meaning the consciousness BEYOND the Mental one that we know of and are still living under, most of us, to a large extent.

This is why on this blog of mine I avoid speaking of “past lives” or ‘future” lives: I speak rather of “other lifetimes”, simply. They all exist actually NOW, in the Eternal NOW, constantly influencing each other beyond our illusory limitations of time, so that every single one of our decisions in any of our simultaneous lives may affect for the worse or for the better the common outcome resulting of all those mutual interactions together, instant after instant. After years of contemplating from time to time what it all might look like, this “Spacious Present” , I have come to start “seeing” it indeed somehow, and it is so fascinating…

Even among these humble so-called “NLP” techniques, the same basic, massive Truth has been stumbled upon and identified to a remarkable extent, just empirically, out of multiple experiences that taken together indicated such a revolutionary possibility: this is what I was given to experience directly myself during the PNL (as we of course say in French) session I decided recently to have with my visiting friend and PNL specialist Danaya (see my recent post about that) who like me is from France.

During the session, while in the light trance-like state in which that “Changing History” PNL technique could be used, I silently chuckled within myself:

“Well, I see… We are really being trained now for a change in our perception of Time!!! What so simple, yet so fantastic possibilities are beginning to offer themselves to us with such a gradual, yet so tremendous a change in our individual consciousnesses! The most portentous aspects of our ongoing Evolution are taking place within us in such an inconspicuous, almost invisible manner, we might not even realize for a long time what enormous, radical changes they truly are…”

Seth and Sri Aurobindo: Extracts from a Dissertation

SETH

Here is the beginning of communication that happened over a few months between me and a researcher also interested in Seth… and in Sri Aurobindo too, as it turns out!…

  1. Joyce Kilmartin
    Feb 14, 2012 @ 01:36:49 [Edit]

    I am studying the Seth material for a dissertation. I am using 6 Seth books for this study. Here is a list of sessions in which I believe Seth is talking about a coming shift in consciousness and what it entails. (to add to your list)
    The abbreviations are: SS-Seth Speaks; PR-the Nature of Personal Reality; UR1-Unknown Reality, vol. 1; UR2, vol. 2; DE1-Dreams, Evolution and Value Fulfillment, vol. 1; DE2, vol. 2

    Reply

    • Bhaga
      Jun 15, 2012 @ 12:19:30 [Edit]

      So sorry, Joyce, that I somehow missed your comment here and am answering it only now!!!
      Also, I couldn’t find the list itself that you mention you are posting for me. What a pity that I couldn’t find that list in your comment, but only the abbreviations list. I’ll try to trace you back and communicate with you more about your research, that I would be so glad indeed to know more about!

      Reply

  2. Joyce Kilmartin
    Jan 07, 2014 @ 20:59:09 [Edit]

    Hi Bhaga,
    We seemed to have crossed in the night. I only just saw your reply to me. I finished my dissertation in 2012. One section was a comparative analysis of the Seth material and Aurobindo’s The Life Divine, which you may find interesting. Here is a link: http://www.sethnet.org/index.php?option=com_mtree&task=att_download&link_id=249&cf_id=24
    My best to you,
    Joyce

    Reply

    • Bhaga
      Jan 08, 2014 @ 07:31:34 [Edit]

      Hi Joyce!
      Great to finally read from you again… and now not just your reply to me, but the whole research document you have put together and are now kindly sending me…
      This is an academic piece of work though, it will take me some time to read it and be able to comment in any way upon it.
      In the meantime would you tell me,if you don’t mind, what personal interest you may have had in all this, that led you to do that impressive research work and finally this entire Dissertation?
      My best to you too, especially as we are starting this New Year 2014!

      Reply

    • Bhaga
      Jan 08, 2014 @ 07:53:34 [Edit]

      Here I am again… to ask you if you would allow me to post these few exchanges we already had, including the link to your Dissertation, up together now as a separate new Post on my blog, under the title perhaps of ‘Seth and Sri Aurobindo: Extracts from a Dissertation’, so that your Dissertation itself can be accessed (or not, as you prefer) and our mutual comments about it in the future can be read by other interested people, thanks to that more visible and more appropriate place than down here as Comments to the ‘Posts List’?!…

      Reply

  3. Joyce Kilmartin
    Jan 08, 2014 @ 18:16:35 [Edit]

    Hi Bhaga,
    Thank you for writing back. How did I get to this point? Hmm. I had a conventional start… college, M.B.A., job in the business world, where I labored quite successfully for 20 years. I started getting headaches and was very restless. Nothing seemed to challenge me or get me excited–(except for my family). I stumbled upon transcendental meditation as a cure for the headaches and could not believe how well and quickly it helped. From there, I started reading and learning about alternative medicine, Eastern religions, etc. Decided to change my life. Took up piano playing. My wonderful music teacher introduced me to many life-altering wisdom teachers and traditions. From her I received my first Seth book. That started me on another 25 years of exploration. It’s been wonderful. Here I am now, in a much better state of mind.

    I read feel like I know a little bit about you from this blog. I like your subject matter and the way you write about it. So happy to make your acquaintance.
    Peace
    Joyce

    Reply

  4. Joyce Kilmartin
    Jan 08, 2014 @ 18:21:14 [Edit]

    Hello again, Bhaga,
    I’m happy for you to post the link to my dissertation and our communications. A doctoral dissertation must have all of those chapters that build the case for one’s research question. The analysis and results are the most interesting parts, though. I wouldn’t expect very many people to want to read the whole thing.

    Looking forward to future discussions. . .

    Reply

So, here we are, poised for discussing the relevant parts of Joyce’s doctoral dissertation,as soon as I will have read enough of it to have meaningful questions. Questions by other people visiting this blog are welcome too of course!

Traduction française de “Seth: You get what you concentrate upon”

SETH : “VOUS OBTENEZ CE SUR QUOI VOUS VOUS CONCENTREZ”

Les interviews données par Anita Moorjani illustrent parfaitement l’un des points principaux qu’elle a appris à travers son EMI et rapportés dans sa vie quotidienne à partir de ce moment-là:
Il est temps que je réitère une fois de plus l’importance de nos pensées, étant donné les résultats qu’en vérité elles ont…
Je vais le faire cette fois-ci grâce à un texte tiré d’un “Seth Book”, “The Magical Approach”, dont je vais traduire ici librement le titre -“La Manière Magique”-  et les passages cités.
Dans ce livre sont rassemblées de nombreuses Sessions données par Seth pour aider Jane (“Ruburt”, comme l’appelle Seth, disant que c’est le nom de son entite plus vaste, d’orientation plus masculine, au-delà de cette vie-là) et son mari Robert Butts à apprendre à considérer avec  plus d’attention une manière alternative de vivre la vie, une manière qui reposerait davantage sur la Réalité plus complète et plus profonde, ‘Tout Ce Qui Est”, dont nos vies individuelles font partie.
Le processus aussi bien que les résultats de cette manière différente paraîtraient pour notre mental inhabituels et irrationnels, mais si merveilleusement efficaces que cela aurait tout l’air d’une manière “magique”, alors que c’est en fait la manière naturelle dont nous avons toujours été supposés faire usage, plutôt que la manière intellectuelle trop limitée et exclusive qui prévaut à notre époque, nous coupant de tout le reste.

EXTRAIT DE LA SESSION DU 28 AOUT 1980, PUBLIEE DANS “LA MANIERE MAGIQUE”:

“Je fais de mon mieux pour expliquer les aspects très pratiques des croyances de l’intellect, et leur force pour attirer vers vous l’expérience correspondante. Il y a eu un temps où tous les deux vous aviez de la difficulté à comprendre certaines de ces idées. Votre relation-même, vos croyances intimes quant à quel genre de personne vous vouliez individuellement pour partager votre vie, déclenchèrent à un niveau incalculable des actions, qui finalement conduisirent à votre rencontre – et pourtant tout cela s’est produit “tout naturellement”, bien sûr. Vos croyances vous mettent en correspondance avec les éléments susceptibles de les confirmer. Elles tirent de “Environnement 2″ tous les ingrédients nécessaires. Elles élicitent des autres personnes le comportement en conformité avec ces croyances.

Vos propres attitudes, par exemple, et convictions – sur les étrangers, Prentice-Hall, la stupidité des gens et leur manque d’intégrité, vous ont mis en correspondance avec les mêmes convictions de la part de ces mêmes autres personnes, causant le fiasco de la traduction*. Un comportement entièrement différent aurait pu être élicité de ces mêmes personnes. Le semblable attire le semblable en l’occurrence.
Ces mêmes personnes, par exemple, pensent toutes, comme vous, qu’on peut faire confiance aux gens, etc, etc – mais dans les conditions où vous étiez à ce moment-là, chacun de vous – ou plutôt vous tous – étiez en correspondance à beaucoup de niveaux. Les livres ont été publiés. Ils ont aidé de nombreuses personnes, et cela parce que vous étiez aussi en correspondance pour beaucoup de vos croyances plus positives, et celles-là l’ont emporté sur les autres.

Vous obtenez ce sur quoi vous vous concentrez, et vos croyances sont en grande partie responsables de ce sur quoi vous vous concentrez.
Il n’y a pas de méthodes magiques, seulement des méthodes naturelles que vous utilisez tout le temps, bien que dans certains cas vous les utilisiez pour des croyances que vous prenez pour des vérités, au lieu des assomptions fautives qu’elles sont. Un petit example – un, incidemment, dont Ruburt s’est finalement rendu compte, mais qui est un bel exemple des méthodes naturelles. Il l’a utilisé magnifiquement, bien que les résultats n’aient pas été plaisants au début. Cela montre aussi la compréhension grandissante de Ruburt:
Il a entendu le bulletin météo pour demain (hier), a grogné, a pensé à une température très inconfortable de 90 degrés Fahrenheit pour demain, et s’est imaginé dans un état lamentable à cause de la chaleur. En effet, il a commencé à avoir plus chaud. Dans un flash il s’est rappelé les jours précédents de malaise, et l’instant d’après il projetait la même chose pour ce week-end. Il se sentit pris au piège. A mi-chemin de ce processus, il essaya de se rattraper, mais il était persuadé que son corps ne pourrait pas supporter la chaleur et cette conviction pesa plus lourd que son intention de changer ses pensées, si bien qu’elles continuèrent de revenir pendant peut-être dix minutes.

Il continua, cependant, à se rappeler qu’il n’allait pas se faire du souci pour demain, aujourd’hui, quoiqu’il en soit. Il se dit que ces prévisions étaient peut-être erronnées, et il commença avec son mental à faire la liste des bonnes raisons qui pourraient d’une manière ou d’une autre amener un résultat différent, plus bénéfique. Il fit cela en se rendant compte de quelle manière précédemment il était arrivé à sa conclusion,  la vieille manière: en choisissant toutes les indications qui allaient dans ce sens-là. Il utilisa le même procédé, simplement cette fois pour arriver à une conclusion plus bénéfique, et le procédé marche. Vous avez seulement à vous en rendre compte.
Votre expérience va dépendre de ce sur quoi vous vous concentrez, ce que vous croyez, ce à quoi vous vous attendez.
Le mental a un grand talent pour la discrimination. Il peut utiliser son raisonnement pour amener presque n’importe quelle expérience possible dans le système où vous vivez.”
*(Note de Robert Butts:
En octobre 1979, Janet et moi avons vu, à notre désarroi, que la maison d’édition hollandaise pour la traduction de “Seth speaks” avait violé son contrat avec Prentice-Hall en faisant beaucoup de coupures non autorisées dans le livre. Il était supposé être publié en son entier, mais des difficultés de langage aboutirent à ce résultat mélangé. Après avoir entendu le point de vue de Jane et de moi-même, et de son éditeur Tam Mossman, la maison d’édition hollandaise  accepta de mettre sur le marché cette année une nouvelle édition sans coupures. Tout cela va revenir cher, et nous  paraît regrettable maintenant que notre colère initiale s’est calmée.)

Si j’en suis moi-même arrivée à considérer le temps qu’il fait comme quelque chose que mes désirs et mes pensées peuvent influencer, par contre le pouvoir de notre attente sur le comportement des autres est quelque chose que personnellement je continue d’oublier!!!
J’en prends conscience quand il s’agit des critiques et sentiments négatifs exprimés par mes amis ou collaborateurs concernant d’autres personnes, et je les gronde pour cela,  mais je fais moi aussi la même bêtise encore et encore, m’en rendant compte en général trop tard, quand j’ai déjà probablement provoqué les résultats négatifs au lieu de ceux plus bénéfiques qui étaient également possibles, eussé-je dirigé mon attente de ce côté-là…

Etant plutôt optimiste de nature, j’ai tendance à d’abord faire confiance aux gens et à n’attendre d’eux que du positif – au point d’être naîve, c’est bien possible. Mais si une fois, ou plusieurs, j’ai été déçue, alors oui, je commence à attendre de la personne en question le même comportement incorrect que j’associe désormais trop automatiquement avec lui ou elle, renforçant sans y prendre garde les risques qu’il ou elle se comporte à nouveau de cette façon répréhensible. Mes pensées devraient au contraire toujours garder la porte ouverte à la possibilité d’une éventualité différente, et devraient même délibérément s’y attendre, afin de donner son maximum de chances à la possibilité meilleure.

Ce qui m’intéresse prodigieusement dans tout cela est qu’enfin ici se trouve une indication véritable sur comment les choses fonctionnent, comment ce monde fonctionne. Ce n’est ni philosophie ni idéalisme, c’est de l’information que je peux utiliser à bon escient dans ma vie quotidienne pour qu’elle aussi fonctionne.

Ce livre précis, “La Manière Magique”,  est l’un de mes préférés dans l’ensemble des “Seth Books”, parce que les Sessions qui le composent ont eu lieu à un moment où Jane/Ruburt et son mari pouvaient voir que quelque chose allait profondément mal, car la santé de Jane se détériorait de plus en plus rapidement et douloureusement. Sa vie intérieure en dehors de son corps physique avec uniquement des aventures où la conscience seule était engagée, avait réellement commencé avec l’arrivée de Seth, donnant à Jane à partir de ce moment-là l’impétus pour tenter des choses dans cette direction pas ordinaire, afin de devenir consciente d’un plus grand nombre des dimensions dans lesquelles un être humain existe aussi.

Mais pendant ce temps-là la vie quotidienne avec ses occupations et activités normales avaient continué sans grand changement dans la manière dont ils les vivaient. Dans ces nouvelles sessions en 1980 Seth, retournant au début de son travail avec eux, leur indiqua de manière très claire ce qui avait manqué de leur part.
A la page 45 il leur dit ceci:
“A un niveau conscient, bien sûr, aucun de vous deux ne s’est rendu compte, ou n’a voulu se rendre compte, du genre de complète abrogation et réorganisation que nos sessions laissaient entendre, et pour quelques années vous avez réussi à garder beaucoup des vues officielles sur la réalité en même temps que les concepts nouveaux, n’étant pas prêts à comprendre qu’une façon de penser entièrement nouvelle allait de soi, une relation nouvelle de l’individu avec la réalité. Alors vous avez essayé quelques méthodes nouvelles par ci, par là,  de manière fragmentaire, avec des résultats suffisamment satisfaisants.”
A nouveau à la page 118 il fait encore la même observation:
“Dans le monde extérieur vous avez tôt formé vos propres croyances et stratégies.  A mi-vie vous avez été confrontés à nos sessions – ou bien vous vous êtes tous les deux confrontés vous-mêmes à nos sessions, si vous préférez. Vous avez reconnu la vitalité inhérente à cette information – mais je le répète, vous ne vous êtes pas rendu compte qu’il s’agissait d’une réorientation complète de vos attitudes. Vous ne vous êtes pas rendu compte que vous étiez confrontés non pas simplement à une vue alternative de la réalité, mais à l’approximation la plus proche que vous pourriez trouver de ce qu’est la réalité, et de comment elle fonctionne, et de ce qu’elle signifie.”

Avoir un mental très indépendant a été bénéfique à Jane au début, car cela l’a protégée d’un emprisonnement dans les dogmes limitants de toute église, et aussi du système médical; mais elle avait gardé le même scepticisme intellectuel vis à vis de ce qui venait de Seth également, bien qu’ils aient eu ces sessions depuis tant d’années. Cette attitude automatique finit par limiter Jane et l’empêcher de bénéficier autant qu’elle l’aurait pu de l’enseignement de Seth.  Sur bon nombre de sujets Jane avait l’impression d’en savoir suffisamment pour ne pas se laisser influencer par ce que Seth disait.

Pour la réincarnation, par exemple: convaincue que rien de tel n’existait, elle résista pied à pied à l’information reçue, au point que pendant longtemps Seth ne pouvait même pas amener ce sujet ouvertement ni dans toute son étendue. Seulement peu à peu accepta-t-elle la possibilité que cela puisse être vrai, ayant eu entre-temps des rêves ou d’autres formes d’expériences intérieures qui confirmaient en effet la véracité du fait.
Mais pourtant, accepter finalement ce que Seth disait sur ce sujet était encore une acceptation fragmentaire, pas une acceptation qui aurait modifié leur existence à un niveau fondamental.

Bien sûr, avoir une EMI et apprendre tout cela par directe expérience de cette vérité entière dans les dimensions-mêmes où nous sommes conscients de la vraie Réalité, est une manière plus facile et plus rapide de l’apprendre, comme nous l’avons vu avec Anita Moorjani!

 

Seth: “You get what you concentrate upon”

The interviews given by Anita Moorjani illustrate so well one of the major points she has learned from her NDE and brought back into her daily life henceforth:
It’s time I re-emphasized once again the importance of our thoughts, given the results they actually lead to…
I’ll do it this time through a quote from a ‘Seth Book’: ‘The Magical Approach’, in which are collected a number of sessions given by Seth to help Jane (‘Ruburt’, as Seth calls her, saying it’s her name as the more masculine-oriented entity beyond this lifetime) and her husband Robert Butts learn to pay more attention to a possible alternate way of living life, a way that would rely more on the vaster and deeper reality, ‘All That Is’, that our individual lives are part of. The process as well as the results of such a different approach would seem to our mind unusual and irrational, but so wonderfully effective that it would seem to be a ‘magical’ approach, but it is actually the natural way we have always been supposed to function, rather than the too limited and exclusive intellectual way prevalent in our times, that cuts us away from everything else:

EXTRACT FROM SESSION OF AUGUST 28, 1980, PUBLISHED IN ‘THE MAGICAL APPROACH’ (p.70 sqq)

“I am doing my best to explain the very practical aspects of the intellect’s beliefs, and their strength in drawing experience to you. At one time you both had difficulty with understanding some of these ideas. Your own relationship, your private beliefs about the sort of persons you wanted individually for mates, brought about incalculable actions that led finally to your meeting – yet it all happened “quite naturally”, of course. Your beliefs bring you into correspondence with the elements likely to lead to their affirmation. They draw from Framework 2 all of the necessary ingredients. They elicit from other people behavior that is in keeping with those beliefs.
Your own attitudes, for example – and beliefs – about foreigners, Prentice-Hall, people’s stupidity and lack of integrity, put you in correspondence with those same beliefs on the part of others, resulting in the translation fiasco. An entirely different kind of behavior could have been elicited from those same people. Like attracts like in this regard. Those same people, for example, all have, as you do, beliefs in peoples’ trustworthiness, and so forth and so forth – but under those conditions, at that time, you each – or rather you all – were in correspondence at many levels. The books were published. They have helped many people, and that is because you were also in correspondence as far as many of your more positive beliefs are concerned, and those did outweigh the others.
You get what you concentrate upon, and your beliefs are largely responsible for those areas on which you concentrate.
There are no magical methods, only natural ones that you use all the time, although in some cases you use them for beliefs that you take for truths, when instead they are quite defective assumptions. A small example – one, incidentally, that Ruburt finally realized; but it is a beautiful instance of natural methods. He used it beautifully, even though the results were not pleasing at first. It also shows Ruburt’s growing understanding:
He heard tomorrow’s weather report (yesterday), groaned, thought of a very uncomfortable 90 degrees temperature tomorrow and imagined himself miserable with the heat. Indeed, he began to feel warmer. In a flash he remembered previous days of discomfort, and in the next moment he projected those into the week-end. He felt trapped. Midway through the process he tried to catch himself, but he believed that his body could not handle the heat and that belief outweighed his intent to change his thoughts, so they kept returning for perhaps ten minutes.
He continued, however, to remind himself that he was not going to worry about tomorrow today, regardless. He told himself that the prediction might be wrong, and he began  with his intellect to pile up evidence that could in one way or another bring about a different, more beneficial experience. He did this by recognizing the way he had earlier been building up the picture in the old manner, by collecting all the evidence that fitted it. He used the same process, only for a more beneficial picture, and the process works. You have only to become aware of it.
Your experience will follow your concentration and belief and expectation. The mind is a great discriminator. It can use its reasoning to bring about almost any possible experience within your framework.”

(Note by Robert Butts:
In October 1979 Jane and I saw, to our dismay, that the Dutch publisher of the translation of ‘Seth speaks’ had violated his contract with Prentice-Hall by making many unauthorized cuts in the book. It was supposed to be published in its entirety, but language difficulties led to the mixup. After hearing from Jane and me and her editor Tam Mossman, the Dutch publisher agreed to market a new, uncut translation of ‘Seth speaks’ this year. This will be an expensive undertaking – one we feel bad about now that our initial anger has passed.)

If I have myself come to see the weather as very much within the scope of influence of my desires and my thoughts, on the other hand the power of our expectations about the behavior of others is something I personally still keep forgetting!!!
I see it happening in the criticisms and negative expectations about others as expressed by my friends or collaborators, and I scold then for that, but I am also doing the same mistake over and over again myself, realizing it generally too late, when I have probably already provoked the wrong results instead of the more beneficial ones that were also possible, if only I had deliberately expected them…

Being rather optimistic by nature, I tend first to trust people and expect only good from them – to the point of being possibly naive. But if once, or several times, I have been disappointed, I do start expecting from the same person the wrong behavior I am now too automatically associating with him or her. reinforcing then unwittingly the chances that he or she will indeed again behave in that same wrong way. My thoughts should on the contrary always keep open the possibility for a different outcome, and even deliberately expect it, so as to give the maximum chances to the better outcome.

What interests me tremendously in all this is that at last here is a veritable clue about the way things work, how this world functions. It’s not philosophy or idealism, it is information I can put to good use in my daily life to make it work.

This specific book, ‘The Magical Approach’, is one of my favorite ones in the whole series of Seth Books, because the sessions in it came at a time when Jane/Ruburt and her husband could see something was deeply off, for her health was deteriorating more and more rapidly and painfully.  Her inner life out of the physical body and when only adventures in consciousness were involved, had really started with the coming of Seth, giving her from then on the impulse to try things in that unusual direction so as to become aware  of more dimensions in which a human being also existed.
But in the meantime daily life and its normal occupations and activities had been going on without much change in the way they were living them. In those new sessions of 1980 Seth, going back to the beginning of his work with them, pointed out very clearly what had been amiss on their part.
On p. 45 already he told them this:
‘At a conscious level, of course, neither of you realized, or wanted to realize, the kind of complete repeal and overhaul that was implied in our sessions, and for some years you managed to hold many official views of reality along with the newer concepts, not ready to understand that an entire new way of thinking was involved, a new relationship of the individual with reality. So you tried out some new methods piecemeal, here and there, with good-enough results.’
Again on p. 118 he will make the same observation:
‘Now in the world you early formed your own beliefs and strategies. In midlife you were presented with our sessions – or the two of you presented yourselves with them, if you prefer. You recognized the overall vitality of our material – but again you didn’t realize that it meant a complete reorientation of your attitudes. You didn’t realize that you were being presented, not merely with an alternate view of reality, but with the closest approximation you could get of what reality was, and how it worked, and what it meant.’

To have a very independent mind had been beneficial at first as it protected Jane from getting imprisoned in the limiting dogmas of any church, and of the medical system as well; but she had mostly kept the same intellectual skepticism towards what came from Seth as well, although they had been having those Sessions for so many years. This unchecked attitude ended up limiting her and preventing her from benefiting as much as she could have out of Seth’s teachings. About quite a few topics Jane felt she knew better than being influenced in her own beliefs by what Seth was saying.
About reincarnation, for example: convinced that no such thing existed, she fiercely resisted the information received, to the extent that for a long time Seth couldn’t even bring up the subject openly and in its full scope. Only gradually did she accept the possibility that it might be true, having in the meantime had dreams or other kinds of inner experiences that did confirm the veracity of the fact.
But still, accepting finally what Seth was saying on this point was a ‘piecemeal’ acceptance, not yet one that modified their existence at a fundamental level.

Of course, to have an NDE and learn it all at once through the direct experience of the truth of it all in the worlds where we are conscious of the true Reality, is an easier and faster way of learning, as we have seen for Anita Moorjani!

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